Argyle Area Civic Council

Minutes and Highlights of 2001. Press Release 12/26/2001

Highlights of 2001

1. Creation of the Argyle Area Civic Council and the By-Laws.
2. Special Area Plan Meetings Oct 22, 2001 through Nov 19, 2001
3. Review of the Lindsey Terrace Apartments storm water planning.
PRESS RELEASE.
4. Creation of the AACC Web Site.
5. Branan Field-Chaffee Road Opens -
Blanding alternative links Clay, Westside

October, November, and December 2001 Minutes

Minutes from the Thursday, October 18, 2001 AACC Meeting
Meeting Held 10-18-2001 7:30 pm at Kirkwood Presbyterian Church
Argyle Area Civic Council

October 18, 2001

The first official meeting of the AACC was called to order at 7:30PM. In attendance were:

David Hodges
Dan Hoard
Bill Lewis
Kenneth Bible
Al Durant
Jim Nulty
Wilma Schnell
Mike Swann

Reading of Previous Minutes
There were no previous minutes.

Old Business
There was no old business.

New Business

The first order of new business was the reading of the proposed by-laws (herein attached). With seven amendments, the by-laws were approved without objections.

The second order of business was the election of officers. The following slate of officers was offered and approved without objection:

President: ________ David Hodges
Vice President: ___ Dan Hoard
2nd Vice President: Bill Lewis
Secretary: ________ Kenneth Bible
Treasurer: ________ Al Durant

Additional members of the Board of Directors include: Jim Nulty, Wilma Schnell, & Mike Swann.

Bible read letters written to the Exec. Dir. Of the St. Johns River Water Management District, and to each of its eight board members, regarding the designed outflow of more than 14,000,000 gallons of ground water from Lindsey Terrace Apartments holding ponds, directly into the Ortega River. The letters pointed out: (1) the drainage pipe is placed two feet beneath the natural dry season water table, (2) errors in the Vestcor engineer's calculations, (3) and the oversight of additional ground water passing through the 25-acres where the project is located. Also mentioned in the letters was the new Toyota dealership on Youngerman Circle that appears to have inadequate water runoff storage capacity. The letters called for an immediate halt of construction on both projects, until satisfactory alternatives can be developed.

The motion was made and seconded to send out the letters, without edit. The motion passed without objection.

A motion was made and seconded to appoint David Hodges and Kenneth Bible to represent the AACC in all matters pertaining to the Special Area Plan, now being developed by Councilwoman Alberta Hipps and Planning and Zoning Director Jeannie Fewell. The motion passed without objection.

There being no further business before the Board, the meeting was adjourned.


Letter to St. Johns River Water Management District Chairman
Argyle Area Civic Association
6517 Arrowroot Drive
Jacksonville, FL 32244
904 777-8930; 904 772-6929 (fax)

October 19, 2001

William W. Kerr, Chairman SJRWMD
BKI, Inc.
325 Fifth Avenue, Suite 208
Indialantic, FL 32903

Dear Chairman Kerr:

We are a civic association contributing to the growth management process in the Argyle area of the City of Jacksonville. Our membership includes representation for over 20,000 homes. We have very serious concerns with permitting activity in our area. We have met with your regional staff, and the matter is under investigation. To complicate matters, the permits have been issued and construction is well under way. Attached hereto is our letter to your staff that identifies the calculation and design errors. We are requesting that you expedite the resolution of this matter in whatever ways are available to you, to minimize harm to the public, and that you take a broader look at the problems we are uncovering for policymaking purposes.

We would appreciate your assuring that these technical matters will be addressed expeditiously. We humbly believe that there are serious environmental impacts associated with these errors. This is an area that is developing very rapidly, from a former rural area to one that is increasingly overbuilt. New development is proceeding at such a speed that errors are being overlooked, resulting in potentially adverse impacts on water quantity and quality as well as other community infrastructure.

In our situation, one permit that we are specifically addressing has been issued to Vestcor (permit number 40-031-68304-1) for an apartment project of 336 units, located near Blanding Boulevard, a highly congested roadway. Based on the information submitted in the permit application, we have concluded that the Natural Water Table was misstated and the effect is a continuous drawdown of groundwater at a rate not less than 14,000,000 gallons per year. Additionally, the calculations were grossly inaccurate. Retention pond capacity is significantly inadequate. Your staff assumed that the application data was correct because the application was under an engineer's seal. The adverse impact on groundwater resources of these errors at the same time the District rightfully urges conservation is one reason we bring this to your attention.

We are also concerned that this particular permit provided for street design to hold storm water as part of the detention system's calculations. The applicant's reason for designing streets so that they hold storm water instead of shed it and using the streets for "storage" is apparently to allow building of greater intensity. This may be a legitimate private interest objective to maximize buildable density, but the impact is to degrade the roadway infrastructure prematurely, causing the
consumption of yet ever more resources. (This does not even take into account the public safety or liability issues of having intentionally flooded streets.)

We find it hard to believe that the regulatory structure of the District would permit these impacts. We hope that you take an interest in the situation, not just for our benefit, but for the larger public interest the District serves. We do intend to follow this permitting in our own area, and appreciate your support of our good faith efforts to avert what we see is a disastrous outcome for our community. Thank you.

Sincerely Yours,

David Hodges, President
Argyle Area Civic Association

cc: The Honorable Tom Feeney,
Speaker of the House, State of Florida

All SJRWMD Boardmembers


Letter to St. Johns River Water Mgmt District Executive Director
Argyle Area Civic Council
6517 Arrowroot Drive
Jacksonville, FL 32244
904 777-8930; 904 772-6929 (fax)

October 19, 2001

Mr. Kirby Green III, Executive Director
St. Johns River Water Management District
P.O. Box 1429
Palatka, FL 32178

Re: Lindsey Terrace Apartments, a Vestcor Construction Project, Permit Number
40-031-68304-1 and the Toyota Dealership, Youngerman Circle, Jacksonville Florida

Dear Mr. Green:

We recently had two meetings with Robin Harrell, Compliance Manager, and Cara Perron, Project Review Engineer, in the District's Jacksonville office. We appreciate the willingness and candor of these staff members to be available for discussions.

The following discrepancies were noted:

(1) Natural runoff flowing onto and into the Lindsey Terrace Apartments property was
not considered in the calculations.

We pointed out that there is an error in the calculations submitted by the Vestcor engineer in his application, which results in a 0.23 cfs understatement in the amount of water leaving this 25-acre site. Correction might include either a 6" orifice drainage pipe, or resorting to a 2:1 slope of the sides of the two retention ponds and enlarging them both.

We also noted that all calculations were based using an erroneous Natural Water Table of 11 feet, when the test borings at the retention pond locations were 13 feet in the dry season and 17 feet in the wet season. Since the top of the retention ponds is at 15, only two feet of water can be stored in these ponds. These ponds may be inadequate to treat storm water, and their capacity would need to be enlarged considerably.

(4) It was also noted that the project's roads and parking areas are being designed as a
"secondary holding area" for runoff. The streets and parking areas were planned to
flood during any significant rainfall, and to hold that water until the 4 feet of water
In the retention pond subsides.

Mr. Harrell stated he would do a site visit, inspect the conditions, and that he would submit the calculations used for the permit to an independent engineer at the City of Jacksonville or JEA. We appreciate the willingness of the staff to take a second look, and to do so with an independent third party.

In its conservation efforts, SJRWMD has imposed watering restrictions even upon shallow wells used for landscaping. It is preposterous that this development is allowed to install an orifice some 2 feet below the Natural Water Table and allow the depletion of ground water by more than 38,000 gallons per day, 365 days per year. This will waste more than 14,000,000 gallons of water every year.

This development is funded mainly by $17,000,000 in funds from SHIP, HUD, and the City of Jacksonville. When we asked about the practicality of having to patch and replace the pavement in this project, because of constant flooding, it was explained that SJRWM is not responsible for the stupidity of the contractor. It appears that the government is determined to make third class citizens of those who are unfortunate enough to require support for their housing needs.

In addition to Lindsey Terrace Apartments, a Toyota dealership is being built across Youngerman Circle. It was mentioned that in order to prevent a similar continuous outflow there, a twenty-acre retention pond would be required. We have not yet seen the calculations involved with that project.

By granting an immediate halt to these projects, considerable savings would be realized, should a determination be made requiring more storage capacity. It may even save the developers from having to demolish completed buildings in order to increase storage capacity. The right decision by the Water Management District at these developments would require the drainage orifices to be placed at the Natural Water Table of 13 feet, and for the calculations of water storage to utilize the Natural Water Table.

If the SJRWMD expects the citizenry to conserve water, then conservation better begin when permits are issued. The Water Management District should not allow the wasting of water by developers while requiring strict compliance from homeowners trying to save their landscaping.

Thank you for your assistance in expediting review and halting these projects, if necessary, to resolve the problems.

Sincerely Yours,

David Hodges,
President, Argyle Area Civic Council

cc: The Honorable Tom Feeney,
Speaker of the House, State of Florida
William W. Kerr
Deon Long
Jeff K. Jennings
Duane Ottenstroer
Clay Albright
W. Michael Branch
David Graham
Ann Moore
Catherine Walker



Minutes from the Thursday, November 15, 2001 AACC Meeting
Meeting of the Argyle Area Civic Council was called to order at 7:30 pm at the Kirkwood Presbyterian Church on November 15, 2001.

Present were:
David Hodges - President
Dan Hoard - Vice President
Bill Lewis - 2nd Vice President
Allen Durant - Treasurer
Marge Allen
Barbara Bible
Mike Dannelly
Allen Durant
Gene Maszy - Highland Lakes President
Henry Mooneyhan
Jim Nulty
Wilma Schnell
Mike Swann
Marie Splane
Lars Jettman
R. Joseph James

It was decided that the AACC would develop a "Letter of Membership" to be given to prospective members and to promote the AACC.

There was a discussion of the site problems with the Lindsey Terrace Apartments and the investigation by the St. Johns Water Management District.
Also mentioned and discussed was the discoloration of the water runoff from the Lindsey Terrace Apartments behind Sturbridge Place and the Publix Shopping Center.

AACC President David Hodges will be meeting with Jacksonville City Engineer E.T. Hall on Friday, November 16, 2001.

Ashley Davis made the motion for President David Hodges to draft a letter to Mayor Delaney and Jacksonville City Council regarding the Florida Department of Transportation tree mitigation dilemma regarding the Florida 9A - I-295 road connector project and to release the state funds.
Seconded by Jim Nulty.
The motion passed unanimously.
President Hodges will send the letter to the attendees of this AACC meeting by email before sending out in final form.

Idea to develop a "Bumper Sticker" to promote Argyle Forest was discussed.

At-Large Group 1 Jacksonville City Councilwoman Faye Rustin spoke to the AACC.
She discussed the city ordinance regarding the 4-inch number address required for businesses and suggested that residences follow suit to make their addresses easier to read for emergency vehicles. (This is not currently required of residences.)

The violation of the "Neighborhood Bill of Rights" and the new five story building that St. Vincent's Medical Center is building next to a historical neighborhood was discussed. (Here is the link to the article in the Florida Times Union: http://www.jacksonville.com/tu-online/stories/111401/bus_7819179.html )

District 13 Jacksonville City Councilwoman Alberta Hipps was also a guest speaker. The following Items were discussed:
1) The Jacksonville Tree Ordinance.
2) Discussion of the landscaping plan of Argyle Forest Boulevard.
. The AACC will see if we can invite the landscape engineer to a meeting in the future.
3) David Hodges "Letter to the Editor" regarding tree mitigation and the Florida 9A - I-295 road connector project in the Florida Times Union was mentioned.
. (Here is the link to the letter in the Florida Times Union: http://www.jacksonville.com/tu-online/stories/100101/opl_7411966.html )

Discussion of the traffic signalization at Youngerman Circle and Blanding Boulevard.

Treasurer Allen Durant made the Motion to Adjourn.
Seconded by Henry Mooneyhan.
The motion passed unanimously.

Recorded by 2nd Vice President Bill Lewis

These Minutes were approved at the Tuesday, December 18, 2001 meeting



Minutes from the Tuesday, December 18, 2001 AACC Meeting

AACC Board of Directors Meeting Tuesday, December 18, 2001
Meeting Called to order at 7:35 P.M. at the Kirkwood Presbyterian Church.

The following persons were in attendance:
Kenneth Bible, Allen Durant, Dan Hoard, David Hodges, Lars Jettman, Bill Lewis, Henry Mooneyhan, Tracie Murphy, David White, David Reagan, Tony Bates.

Minutes from the November 15, 2001 meeting were read and approved.

A proposed press release regarding the storm water runoff problems at Lindsey Terrace Apartments was read, corrected and approved for release on 12/26/01. See attachment (Link at the Bottom).

The release of an independent engineering review of the Lindsey Terrace Apartments' engineering permit was approved. This document will be released to the media, at the discretion of David Hodges, when it has been completed and reviewed. This is expected to occur prior to the January 2002 AACC meeting.

The "letter to the editor" by David Hodges, calling for a stop to the planting of roadside trees, and for diverting the funds to area schools was discussed. Mr. Hodges pointed out that over 8,000 highway deaths per year involve drivers running into trees and telephone/power poles. (Link at the Bottom)

Bill Lewis reminded everyone that the new AACC website is now posted and operational. It is located at http://www.neighborhoodlink.com/jacksonville/AACC. It is recommended that interested parties establish this as one of your "favorite places", since it is continuously updated with new information and news about our area.

Six committees were established:

Tracie Murphy and Dan Hoard: Business Selection and recruiting for the new business district to be located in the area of Argyle Forest Blvd, and Brannonfield-Chaffee Road.

Kenneth Bible: Police Substation site selection and negotiations for unit to be located near the east end of Argyle Forest Blvd.

Henry Mooneyhan: Fire Station site selection and negotiations for unit to be located near Westport Road and Argyle Forest Blvd.

Lars Jettman: Road and Highway Improvements will be researched and recommendations made to Council Member Alberta Hipps, the JTA and FDOT. Focus will be on saving lives, reducing accidents, and improving traffic flow.

David Reagan and Bill Lewis: Media Releases and Community News will be coordinated to insure maximum exposure for the AACC actions, directions, and general information. This will occur in both Clay and Duval Counties.

Allen Durant and David Reagan: Neighborhood Watch Certification Program will be established throughout the entire AACC area. Watson Real Estate has a $500 reward for certified neighborhood watch members, and will assist with materials to help establish the program.

Bill Lewis reported that he had talked with Council Member Alberta Hipps, JTA and City Engineering Officials regarding the opening of the remaining portion of Argyle Forest Blvd. to Branan Field-Chaffee Road. The road can not be opened until storm water treatment areas are engineered and completed. This is not expected to happen until sometime in March 2002.

A Special Request will be e-mailed, asking that everyone submit suggestions for improvements for the Argyle Area. We will be seeking a $200,000 grant from Front Porch Florida to establish a coordinated effort for major and minor improvements. Once the AACC has been certified and these funds have been obtained, additional grants, governmental approvals and private donations will provide the money to develop the enhancements we want. This program will continue as the
Implementation segment of the "Special Area Plan" (Link at the Bottom), Council Member Alberta Hipps has established for the Argyle area.

Meeting adjourned 9:25 P.M.

Recorded by Kenneth Bible, Secretary AACC

These minutes were corrected and approved via email.

Press Release - Argyle Area Civic Council - Jax, FL - 12/26/2001

Review of the Lindsey Terrace Apartments storm water planning.
PRESS RELEASE
Argyle Area Civic Council
Press Release: 12/26/2001; Jacksonville, FL
David Hodges, President
Argyle Area Civic Council (AACC)
In our review of the Lindsey Terrace Apartments, we discovered a lot of unexplained and unusual circumstances. The City of Jacksonville and the Jacksonville Housing Authority made their decisions in haste. We know of course, that Vestcor is well connected and expected special treatment from the City. However, given the risk of creating a new social welfare ghetto that was isolated from schools, parks, libraries, medical care and jobs, we expected that there would be a little more thought given to this project. Then-Council President Alberta Hipps, told us that the City’s lawyers advised her and the City Council that there was no choice but to grant approvals for the project.
These apartments not only are ill conceived, but they add a burden to our roads at a time when we are already in a grossly overloaded situation. It is so bad, in fact, that Councilperson Alberta Hipps and Clay Council Chairman Pat McGovern have created a Special Area Planning Committee to develop solutions to the problems caused by years of poor planning and over-development in the Argyle area.
The Lindsey Terrace Apartment project had every indication that it was greased through the local governmental agencies. We were really astounded when we learned about the storm water permitting situation. Even the Water Management District let this project slide.
What we first discovered was the unusual slopes of the roads and parking lots that were being built for the apartments. We thought it was some mistake. We learned, however, that the roads and parking were purposefully designed to retain water, not shed it off the crown of the road. The road is shaped so that the middle of the apartment’s roadway will actually hold water.
Usually the middle of a road is the highest point on the road surface and the road edges the lowest. This shape allows water to run off the road quickly and into the drainage system. For the Lindsey Apartments, however, the roads and parking areas are part of the drainage retention system!
We figured out that this design was done to allow more building density on the land. By using the roads and the parking lots as a major part of the drainage retention system, the amount of land needed for the usual retention ponds would be reduced, allowing more land to be available for building even more apartments.
Of course, we were upset by this, and went to the Water Management District to see how this could have happened. Vestcor filed the permit application, but the District staff candidly admitted that they did not check the data. They just assumed it was right because a Vestcor engineer signed the application.
Well, those circumstances made us look even more. We learned to our horror that the permit allowed the water levels to rise within a few inches of the top of the bank of one retention pond, and within one-half inch of the top of the bank for the larger pond designed to hold the runoff storm water. The City normally requires 12 inches of clearance (freeboard) between the water level and the top of the bank. We were astounded since all of you know how the entrance from Argyle Forest Blvd. already floods. Worse yet, the application even says that Vestcor’s design fails to provide for the adjacent run-off and creates a risk of the river reversing its flow whenever the Ortega River is cresting. This event occurred four years ago, causing flooding over Argyle Forest Blvd, and into streets and homes up river.
We talked with engineers to get advice about all of this; got copies of the permit application and other materials; visited with the Water Management folks; and spoke to our local and state officials. Some were very concerned with what appeared to be true but wanted more conclusive information.
Because we are not experts at storm water planning, we decided to hire an expert. He is studying the permit, as well as the surrounding area. His report should be ready shortly after the first of the year. Meetings with this expert have confirmed what we feared, so this will be an important study.
When the report is issued, we will share all of the results with the AACC, the general public, and most importantly with federal, state and local officials. This is truly a travesty in planning and unfortunately our neighborhoods have to take the brunt of it.

End of Press Release: 12/26/2001; Jacksonville, FL
Information about the Argyle Area Civic Council
The Argyle Area Civic Council (AACC) is a neighborhood organization dedicated to informing the residents of the Argyle Forest Area, including those in adjoining Clay County, about neighborhood issues. The AACC studies those issues and through elected officials and governmental agencies works toward acceptable solutions.
The Board of Directors consists of one member from each neighborhood within the area, and represents an area of some 40,000 acres, with over 6,000 private homes and multifamily dwellings growing to 20,000 homes in the next ten years.

Argyle Area Civic Council
6517 Arrowroot Drive
Jacksonville, FL 32244
Phone: 904-777-8930
eFax: 520-833-6189
email: ArgyleACC@yahoo.com
Web Site: http://www.neighborhoodlink.com/jacksonville/aacc

Email us
ArgyleACC@joimail.com

Important Web Links

Argyle Area Civic Council By-Laws - Adopted 10-18-2001
Special Area Plan Meetings Oct 22, 2001 through Nov 19, 2001
Branan Field-Chaffee Road Opens - Blanding Blvd Alternative