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Were we forewarned of this? Uh, yeh

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  • hiroad
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Killing babies no different from abortion, experts say

Parents should be allowed to have their newborn babies killed because they are   “morally irrelevant” and ending their lives is no different to abortion, a   group of medical ethicists linked to Oxford University has argued.

 

By , Medical Correspondent

1:38PM GMT 29 Feb 2012

 

The   article, published in the Journal of Medical Ethics, says newborn   babies are not “actual persons” and do not have a “moral right to life”. The   academics also argue that parents should be able to have their baby killed   if it turns out to be disabled when it is born.

The journal’s editor, Prof Julian Savulescu, director of the Oxford Uehiro   Centre for Practical Ethics, said the article's authors had received death   threats since publishing the article. He said those who made abusive and   threatening posts about the study were “fanatics opposed to the very values   of a liberal society”.

The article, entitled “After-birth abortion: Why should the baby live?”, was   written by two of Prof Savulescu’s former associates, Alberto Giubilini and   Francesca Minerva.

They argued: “The moral status of an infant is equivalent to that of a fetus   in the sense that both lack those properties that justify the attribution of   a right to life to an individual.”

Rather than being “actual persons”, newborns were “potential persons”. They   explained: “Both a fetus and a newborn certainly are human beings and   potential persons, but neither is a ‘person’ in the sense of ‘subject of a   moral right to life’.

 

“We take ‘person’ to mean an individual who is capable of attributing to her   own existence some (at least) basic value such that being deprived of this   existence represents a loss to her.”

As such they argued it was “not possible to damage a newborn by preventing her   from developing the potentiality to become a person in the morally relevant   sense”.

The authors therefore concluded that “what we call ‘after-birth abortion’   (killing a newborn) should be permissible in all the cases where abortion   is, including cases where the newborn is not disabled”.

They also argued that parents should be able to have the baby killed if it   turned out to be disabled without their knowing before birth, for example   citing that “only the 64 per cent of Down’s syndrome cases” in Europe are   diagnosed by prenatal testing.

Once such children were born there was “no choice for the parents but to keep   the child”, they wrote.

“To bring up such children might be an unbearable burden on the family and on   society as a whole, when the state economically provides for their care.”

However, they did not argue that some baby killings were more justifiable than   others – their fundamental point was that, morally, there was no difference   to abortion as already practised.

They preferred to use the phrase “after-birth abortion” rather than   “infanticide” to “emphasise that the moral status of the individual killed   is comparable with that of a fetus”.

Both Minerva and Giubilini know Prof Savulescu through Oxford. Minerva was a   research associate at the Oxford Uehiro Centre for Practical Ethics until   last June, when she moved to the Centre for Applied Philosophy and Public   Ethics at Melbourne University.

Giubilini, a former visiting student at Cambridge University, gave a talk in   January at the Oxford Martin School – where Prof Savulescu is also a   director – titled 'What is the problem with euthanasia?'

He too has gone on to Melbourne, although to the city’s Monash University.   Prof Savulescu worked at both univerisities before moving to Oxford in 2002.

Defending   the decision to publish in a British Medical Journal blog, Prof   Savulescu, said that arguments in favour of killing newborns were “largely   not new”.

What Minerva and Giubilini did was apply these arguments “in consideration of   maternal and family interests”.

While accepting that many people would disagree with their arguments, he   wrote: “The goal of the Journal of Medical Ethics is not to present the   Truth or promote some one moral view. It is to present well reasoned   argument based on widely accepted premises.”

Speaking to The Daily Telegraph, he added: “This “debate” has been an   example of “witch ethics” - a group of people know who the witch is and seek   to burn her. It is one of the most dangerous human tendencies we have. It   leads to lynching and genocide. Rather than argue and engage, there is a   drive is to silence and, in the extreme, kill, based on their own moral   certainty. That is not the sort of society we should live in.”

He said the journal would consider publishing an article positing that, if   there was no moral difference between abortion and killing newborns, then   abortion too should be illegal.

Dr Trevor Stammers, director of medical ethics at St Mary's University   College, said: "If a mother does smother her child with a blanket, we   say 'it's doesn't matter, she can get another one,' is that what we want to   happen?

"What these young colleagues are spelling out is what we would be the   inevitable end point of a road that ethical philosophers in the States and   Australia have all been treading for a long time and there is certainly   nothing new."

Referring to the term "after-birth abortion", Dr Stammers added: "This   is just verbal manipulation that is not philosophy. I might refer to   abortion henceforth as antenatal infanticide."

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/healthnews/9113394/Killing-babies-no-different-from-abortion-experts-say.html

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Who decides when your kids or grandkids become "actual" persons?  Right now it's the mother deciding when its OK to kill and when its not.  I guess the Obumbler's new "free" program will eventually take care of all that.

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Who decides when your kids or grandkids become "actual" persons?  Right now it's the mother deciding when its OK to kill and when its not.  I guess the Obumbler's new "free" program will eventually take care of all that.

I don't think we've got to the point where a mother can decide a 10 month old is not an "actual" person.

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Sadly Mallory,  I see children each day who's parents apparantly feel this way.  The kids I'm refering to are school age.  It's easy to be a mother or father.  It's alot tougher to be a parent.

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