Muscatine

What is the downside to this idea?

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  • nedl
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I always wanted a phonetic dictionary on the shelves. But regardless of spelling she is correct mathematically. Stoooopid or not, the point was that we had a solution put forth that seems a bit sound to me too. But I'd be shootin for $15,000 a head and no more constitutional birthrights for their little aught-to-be illegal babies. Too bad our founders weren't insightful enough to imagine how that one might have turned out. Plus just think of the capital from the rest of them wanting to buy their way in. The down side? By the time all the drug money gets the rest of mexico's population here, we might just as well be called Mexerica. Might sound a tad racist, but with that in mind, I'm glad I won't likely live long enough to see just how many more will be here in the next twenty years, especially since we won't be employed any longer anyway.

bdi- look up the words aught and ought and see which word is correct in the term  you used. When you don't have a dictionary, there is always dictionary.com.

Aught ought taut taught naught fought what ever..somehow her math seemed to be the issue. I doubt very much her spelling or anyone else had anything to do with insanity. However, since that stands yet to be clear, her math was correct. But it seems odd to me that all you got outta that whole perspective was that someone mizpelded some words. How about the point of the thread? Do you concur doc, 2.000 or 15,000 sounds better?
 


You're whistling in the dark here. This bunch would rather nit-pic some nonsensical little detail to death than argue the point of the thread.

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  • hiroad
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Kudos for trying Opie!  There needs to be a national discussion/brain picking/problem solving session on the illegal alien problem.

 

Regarding your suggestion, I assumed you offered it as a kind of starting point for some sensible discussion and argument regarding a "fix".  Thanks for that.

 

My opinion:

I'm not sure that voting rights, driver's licenses, etc. are enough incentive for an illegal to come forth and spring for $2000 or better yet $15,000.

If the perks that come with citizenship are enough of an incentive, what will prevent a rush across the border to gain citizenship?  I can see a certain political party ponying up the $2000 per alien to get them into the voting booths, can't you?

You know the bunch I'm talking about.

I liked Eisenhower's procedure back in the 50's.  He didn't just ship them back across the border (too easy to return to the U.S.), he shipped them, by sea, down to Yucatan at the southern part of Mexico and let them work their way back up if they had that much gumption.  Not many returned to the U.S. after that experience.

Either way, nothing is going to work until we do whatever it takes to secure our borders.

But I say keep the ideas coming. 

 I hope the next Pres. does solicit ideas from the vast pool of common street wise people for potential solutions to all our significant problems.  Before he does that, he does need to expressly define, in writing, each problem, using professional problem solving techniques.

 

I always wanted a phonetic dictionary on the shelves. But regardless of spelling she is correct mathematically. Stoooopid or not, the point was that we had a solution put forth that seems a bit sound to me too. But I'd be shootin for $15,000 a head and no more constitutional birthrights for their little aught-to-be illegal babies. Too bad our founders weren't insightful enough to imagine how that one might have turned out. Plus just think of the capital from the rest of them wanting to buy their way in. The down side? By the time all the drug money gets the rest of mexico's population here, we might just as well be called Mexerica. Might sound a tad racist, but with that in mind, I'm glad I won't likely live long enough to see just how many more will be here in the next twenty years, especially since we won't be employed any longer anyway.

bdi- look up the words aught and ought and see which word is correct in the term  you used. When you don't have a dictionary, there is always dictionary.com.

Aught ought taut taught naught fought what ever..somehow her math seemed to be the issue. I doubt very much her spelling or anyone else had anything to do with insanity. However, since that stands yet to be clear, her math was correct. But it seems odd to me that all you got outta that whole perspective was that someone mizpelded some words. How about the point of the thread? Do you concur doc, 2.000 or 15,000 sounds better?
 

I find msmal's posts insufferable. She/he/it argues any and every thing. It becomes quite tiring to read the posts and try to make some sense out of them.


The idea of illegals buying their way to citizenship is not an idea that I could embrace at any price, so the math is irrelevant to me.

 

As to your use of a wrong word - you are free to do that but you realize that you change the meaning of your post when you do that . I thought you learned something from dick and duck.

 

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WASHINGTON

George W. Bush isn't the first Republican president to face a full-blown immigration crisis on the US-Mexican border.

Fifty-three years ago, when newly elected Dwight Eisenhower moved into the White House, America's southern frontier was as porous as a spaghetti sieve. As many as 3 million illegal migrants had walked and waded northward over a period of several years for jobs in California, Arizona, Texas, and points beyond.

President Eisenhower cut off this illegal traffic. He did it quickly and decisively with only 1,075 United States Border Patrol agents – less than one-tenth of today's force. The operation is still highly praised among veterans of the Border Patrol.

Although there is little to no record of this operation in Ike's official papers, one piece of historic evidence indicates how he felt. In 1951, Ike wrote a letter to Sen. William Fulbright (D) of Arkansas. The senator had just proposed that a special commission be created by Congress to examine unethical conduct by government officials who accepted gifts and favors in exchange for special treatment of private individuals.

General Eisenhower, who was gearing up for his run for the presidency, said "Amen" to Senator Fulbright's proposal. He then quoted a report in The New York Times, highlighting one paragraph that said: "The rise in illegal border-crossing by Mexican 'wetbacks' to a current rate of more than 1,000,000 cases a year has been accompanied by a curious relaxation in ethical standards extending all the way from the farmer-exploiters of this contraband labor to the highest levels of the Federal Government."

Years later, the late Herbert Brownell Jr., Eisenhower's first attorney general, said in an interview with this writer that the president had a sense of urgency about illegal immigration when he took office.

America "was faced with a breakdown in law enforcement on a very large scale," Mr. Brownell said. "When I say large scale, I mean hundreds of thousands were coming in from Mexico [every year] without restraint."

Although an on-and-off guest-worker program for Mexicans was operating at the time, farmers and ranchers in the Southwest had become dependent on an additional low-cost, docile, illegal labor force of up to 3 million, mostly Mexican, laborers.

According to the Handbook of Texas Online, published by the University of Texas at Austin and the Texas State Historical Association, this illegal workforce had a severe impact on the wages of ordinary working Americans. The Handbook Online reports that a study by the President's Commission on Migratory Labor in Texas in 1950 found that cotton growers in the Rio Grande Valley, where most illegal aliens in Texas worked, paid wages that were "approximately half" the farm wages paid elsewhere in the state.

Profits from illegal labor led to the kind of corruption that apparently worried Eisenhower. Joseph White, a retired 21-year veteran of the Border Patrol, says that in the early 1950s, some senior US officials overseeing immigration enforcement "had friends among the ranchers," and agents "did not dare" arrest their illegal workers.

Walt Edwards, who joined the Border Patrol in 1951, tells a similar story. He says: "When we caught illegal aliens on farms and ranches, the farmer or rancher would often call and complain [to officials in El Paso]. And depending on how politically connected they were, there would be political intervention. That is how we got into this mess we are in now."

Bill Chambers, who worked for a combined 33 years for the Border Patrol and the then-called US Immigration and Naturalization Service (INS), says politically powerful people are still fueling the flow of illegals.

During the 1950s, however, this "Good Old Boy" system changed under Eisenhower – if only for about 10 years.

In 1954, Ike appointed retired Gen. Joseph "Jumpin' Joe" Swing, a former West Point classmate and veteran of the 101st Airborne, as the new INS commissioner.

Influential politicians, including Sen. Lyndon B. Johnson (D) of Texas and Sen. Pat McCarran (D) of Nevada, favored open borders, and were dead set against strong border enforcement, Brownell said. But General Swing's close connections to the president shielded him – and the Border Patrol – from meddling by powerful political and corporate interests.

 

One of Swing's first decisive acts was to transfer certain entrenched immigration officials out of the border area to other regions of the country where their political connections with people such as Senator Johnson would have no effect.

Then on June 17, 1954, what was called "Operation Wetback" began. Because political resistance was lower in California and Arizona, the roundup of aliens began there. Some 750 agents swept northward through agricultural areas with a goal of 1,000 apprehensions a day. By the end of July, over 50,000 aliens were caught in the two states. Another 488,000, fearing arrest, had fled the country.

By mid-July, the crackdown extended northward into Utah, Nevada, and Idaho, and eastward to Texas.

By September, 80,000 had been taken into custody in Texas, and an estimated 500,000 to 700,000 illegals had left the Lone Star State voluntarily.

Unlike today, Mexicans caught in the roundup were not simply released at the border, where they could easily reenter the US. To discourage their return, Swing arranged for buses and trains to take many aliens deep within Mexico before being set free.

Tens of thousands more were put aboard two hired ships, the Emancipation and the Mercurio. The ships ferried the aliens from Port Isabel, Texas, to Vera Cruz, Mexico, more than 500 miles south.

The sea voyage was "a rough trip, and they did not like it," says Don Coppock, who worked his way up from Border Patrolman in 1941 to eventually head the Border Patrol from 1960 to 1973.

Mr. Coppock says he "cannot understand why [President] Bush let [today's] problem get away from him as it has. I guess it was his compassionate conservatism, and trying to please [Mexican President] Vincente Fox."

There are now said to be 12 million to 20 million illegal aliens in the US. Of the Mexicans who live here, an estimated 85 percent are here illegally.

Border Patrol vets offer tips on curbing illegal immigration

One day in 1954, Border Patrol agent Walt Edwards picked up a newspaper in Big Spring, Texas, and saw some startling news. The government was launching an all-out drive to oust illegal aliens from the United States.

The orders came straight from the top, where the new president, Dwight Eisenhower, had put a former West Point classmate, Gen. Joseph Swing, in charge of immigration enforcement.

General Swing's fast-moving campaign soon secured America's borders – an accomplishment no other president has since equaled. Illegal migration had dropped 95 percent by the late 1950s.

Several retired Border Patrol agents who took part in the 1950s effort, including Mr. Edwards, say much of what Swing did could be repeated today.

"Some say we cannot send 12 million illegals now in the United States back where they came from. Of course we can!" Edwards says.

Donald Coppock, who headed the Patrol from 1960 to 1973, says that if Swing and Ike were still running immigration enforcement, "they'd be on top of this in a minute."

William Chambers, another '50s veteran, agrees. "They could do a pretty good job" sealing the border.

Edwards says: "When we start enforcing the law, these various businesses are, on their own, going to replace their [illegal] workforce with a legal workforce."

While Congress debates building a fence on the border, these veterans say other actions should have higher priority.

1. End the current practice of taking captured Mexican aliens to the border and releasing them. Instead, deport them deep into Mexico, where return to the US would be more costly.

2. Crack down hard on employers who hire illegals. Without jobs, the aliens won't come.

3. End "catch and release" for non-Mexican aliens. It is common for illegal migrants not from Mexico to be set free after their arrest if they promise to appear later before a judge. Few show up.

The Patrol veterans say enforcement could also be aided by a legalized guest- worker program that permits Mexicans to register in their country for temporary jobs in the US. Eisenhower's team ran such a program. It permitted up to 400,000 Mexicans a year to enter the US for various agriculture jobs that lasted for 12 to 52 weeks.

 

LET'S NOT FORGET ABOUT ALL THE IMMIGRATES THAT ARE FOLLOWING THE LAW, IF YOU ARE HERE ILLEGALLY WHY SHOULD YOU GET TO JUMP THE LINE FOR BAD BEHAVIOR. Want to stop illegal immigration cut off the jobs, schooling, handouts and paths to citizenships, with that gone why would they come here!!!!

 

Under the Mexican law, illegal immigration is a felony, punishable by up to two years in prison. Immigrants who are deported and attempt to re-enter can be imprisoned for 10 years. Visa violators can be sentenced to six-year terms. Mexicans who help illegal immigrants are considered criminals.

The law also says Mexico can deport foreigners who are deemed detrimental to “economic or national interests,” violate Mexican law, are not “physically or mentally healthy” or lack the “necessary funds for their sustenance” and for their dependents.

“This sounds like the kind of law that a rational nation would have to protect itself against illegal immigrants — that would stop and punish the very people who are violating the law,” said Rep. Steve King of Iowa, ranking Republican on the House Judiciary subcommittee on immigration, citizenship, refugees, border security and international law.

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